Up for Debate: Death of an American ambassador

Wednesday, September 12, 2012 at 11:06pm

What's your reaction to the violence in Benghazi, Libya, that left a U.S. ambassador dead along with members of his staff? If it's true the violence leading to the deaths was prompted in part by an American-made video that criticized the Prophet Muhammad should those who promoted the video be held responsible or reprimanded in some way?

 

Filed under: City Voices
Tagged: Up for Debate

215 Comments on this post:

By: Ask01 on 9/13/12 at 12:19

Individuals have mocked religion for centuries.

Every religion has, as best I can find in references, been the target of angst by non believers. I believe the destruction of ancient religious icons by the Islam inspired Taliban in Afghanistan if I recall correctly represents the ultimate insult to that religious sect.

Christianity is the daily target of many, and yet, we rarely hear of such extreme reactions. Oh, to be sure, Christianity, sometimes with the total support of theological leaders has a bloody history of suppressing and silencing critics, but those days are, hopefully, permanently in the past.

For supporters and followers of Islam to react with such uncivilized fury, like illiterate bumpkins, speaks very poorly of any religion and only serves to bring the legitimacy of a faith into question.

The video was an insult to Islam, but, at the risk and hope of antagonizing adherents, I feel they should put on their big boy or girl pants, and get over themselves. If a religion and followers cannot survive people making fun, I am not impressed by their substance.

The vandalism of a US embassy and murder of the ambassador borders on an act of war. Had this been the actions of, not religious fanatics, but politically inspired militants angry over US actions, people would be calling for military strikes.

The bottom line, for me anyway, is this violence only serves to discredit Islam and the claims of being a religion of tolerance and peace. The world needs to view this action for what it is; an immature, juvenile reaction, employing violence, by a faction unable to express themselves in any other manner.

Once again, the video may have been in poor taste, but the reaction was downright criminal, and needs to lead America to reconsider the stability of our alliances with those in this part of the world influenced by this religion of peace.

By: yogiman on 9/13/12 at 1:37

If Islam is a religion of tolerance and peace as they claim, why do they believe you should die if you don't believe in their faith?

Because an American Embassy is considered on American soil, that was an act of war. Why was the President so silent for so long?

By: bfra on 9/13/12 at 1:47

Thanks Ask01 for the only coherent comment thus far!

By: bfra on 9/13/12 at 1:48

Thanks Ask01 for the only coherent comment thus far!

By: dargent7 on 9/13/12 at 4:37

Now they're storming the US Embassy in Yemen.
Seems to be triggered by 9/11 and a Youtube video.
This insanity started 20 years ago when Rushdie wrote "Satanic Verses" and the current Ayatolla put a $5. million bounty on his head....for his head on a platter.
Yes, indeed, Islam is a religion of peace and Muslims are a peaceful, thoughtful bunch.
And Detroit is a wonderful vacation destination.

By: dargent7 on 9/13/12 at 4:42

Ask01: "...The world needs to view this action for what it is; an immature, juvenile reaction, employing violence by a faction unable to express themselves in any other manner."
Kind of sums up the Bush & Co. administration with the war in Iraq, doesn't it?

By: Ask01 on 9/13/12 at 5:01

One of the grievances against America voiced by Osama bin Laden was the presence in Muslim nations of infidels (us) and the agents of the Great Satan (US government employees,) or some such nonsense justification.

Perhaps it is time to posthumously grant that wish and pull out from all the nations where backwards, ignorant, zealots, whipped into a frenzy by rabble rousing Imams storm our embassies and murder our diplomats.

When we leave, however, we should take all our money with us. All foreign aid, domestic, economic, and military should be cut off. Plus, any structures we funded should be razed to the ground and demolished to aid and hasten their descent into pre medieval society.

In short, summing up the long winded rhetoric, not another dime for anything, and what we have built, we destroy. If they, these dedicated peace loving, tolerant, religious adherents wish to live in a culture of the first millenia, let us help them achieve that goal.

We spent untold sums in futile attempts to buy their friendship and keep these nations with their backward populations out of the Russian sphere. The Russians are in worse financial straits than we, so let them bankrupt themselves and get their people killed if they want to associate with these nations.

Just my poor, high school educated opinion.

By: dargent7 on 9/13/12 at 5:28

This just in...Tunisia, Egypt, Libya, Yemen all are experiencing violence.
Romney is slamming Obama for his actions, or inactions.
Republicans want to start a bombing mission followed by a ground assault.
Not knowing who the real enemy is.
Come out blasting, ask questions later.
No to Romney in 2012.

By: dargent7 on 9/13/12 at 5:29

This just in...Tunisia, Egypt, Libya, Yemen all are experiencing violence.
Romney is slamming Obama for his actions, or inactions.
Republicans want to start a bombing mission followed by a ground assault.
Not knowing who the real enemy is.
Come out blasting, ask questions later.
No to Romney in 2012.

By: dargent7 on 9/13/12 at 5:30

Sorry...speech impediment.

By: gdiafante on 9/13/12 at 6:08

Sorry folks...it's common knowledge that Muslims do not like their prophet to be portrayed in film, parody or otherwise. We know this. Most people respect this, because when you don't, you get what we have now.

Now, to be clear, this isn't really about U.S. policy, this is about extremists escalating a situation. Give an inch, they take a mile. Give them something to be pissed about and they'll be vocal. When they're vocal, more organized factions can hide behind those voices and do some great damage.

But, as Barney Fife would say, this thing needs to be nipped in the bud. I have no sympathy for the filmmaker and I can't help but think this was intentional, a way to incite bad behavior so he could then say, "See...they are what we thought they were!"

And now the coward is hiding while Americans are dying...

By: dargent7 on 9/13/12 at 6:26

We have two warships and dozens of Marines on their way.
Obama should have taken extra precaution knowing 9/11 was the 11th anniversary.
This Youtube movie had been up since June.
Just recently ran with Arabic sub-titles to set these animals off. It doesn't take much.
How was he, Obama, to know violence would spread out to 4 countries?
Where's our butt-buddy Saudi Arabia in all this? India? Japan? China? All busy making money off of Americans.
The Republican response is typical: "bombs away, kill innocent civilians, protecting our interests..." which is Romney's plan.
Obama's thinking this through. Like JFK during the Cuban Missile Crisis.
Bush, Romney, any Republican would of started WW III in 1962.

By: gdiafante on 9/13/12 at 6:38

I agree about Romney. But he's just saying what he thinks the base wants to hear. I'm not sure what warships and leathernecks can do...if we put boots on the ground, look out. Forget an October surprise, we'll kick off a September slaughter.

And you think they don't want us there now?

I'm not sure what the solution is...

By: parnell3rd on 9/13/12 at 6:48

great points ask 01.
Our Gov't Policy (Obama's gov't) of not having better security at our embassy's resulted in American's dying.
Why should the people who made this supposed video be held acoountable for the violence? Did they start the violence? Is islam trulely a kind and tolerant religion? We have been told how kind and tolerant they are since 9/11.
I saw a picture on a tailgate of a pickup truck. The picture was the Twin Towers burning. The words said this "Everthing I needed to know about islam, I learned on 9/11"

By: Ummm... on 9/13/12 at 6:49

When the U.S. is attacked...attack the president!
-Mitt Romney

By: dargent7 on 9/13/12 at 6:52

The solution?
Start by having the United States NOT run the planet.
Romney & Rice want to use pre-emptive force to control local skirmishes.
If Gadaffi, Hussein, Cavez, Jong Ill, etal. are such monsters, let the local community get rid of them.
We bomb the shit out of them, kill innocent civilians, say, "We're terribly sorry", and do it over and over again. Then install "our boy" in the position of power who's just as corrupt as the guy we had killed.
All we do is piss off the local population who are loyal to these leaders.
eg., Iraqi's danced in the streets 9 years ago.
Now, 50 every other day, are killed in a suicide bomb. Is Iraq better that Saddam is gone? To a moron.
All these Harvard educated lawyers running Washington don't know shit about local tribes, customs, power.
Making the entire world look like America by force is a doomed failure from the start.

By: dargent7 on 9/13/12 at 6:58

s/h/b Hugo Chavez. Add in the Syrian guy who's killing hundreds a week.
How does this even happen?
The USA has to travel 6,000 miles to stop it?
What about regional powers? Japan is a hell of alot closer.
Save on the gas alone.

By: gdiafante on 9/13/12 at 6:59

So we shouldn't have an embassy/consulate in any Arab nation at all...just leave...and then, in a few years to a decade later, when the area is completely overrun by Islamic hardliners (think Christian Fundamentalist with no impulse control), then what? WWIII anyway?

Whether you like it or not, or are afraid of it or not, Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world...it isn't going anywhere. So why shouldn't we at least attempt to try and get a long rather than speed up the apocalypse?

Parnell, the difficult thing about this is applying our Constitutional morality on someone else. I think that putting out an anti-Islamic film in an Arab nation is equal to going to Harlem with a sign that says "I hate n******". Nothing good is going to happen.

By: yogiman on 9/13/12 at 7:05

Why did Obama wait so many hours after the murders before asking Hillary to make the comment? Shouldn't he have made it himself as our President?

I guess he doesn't feel obligated to follow Harry Truman's "The buck stops here" attitude.

By: dargent7 on 9/13/12 at 7:14

Truman? First and only President to use atomic bombs. Two of them. Killed 500,000 people . Pearl Harbor killed 2,500.
Seems like a fair exchange.
Like Saddam invaded Kuwait, gassed 100 of his own people, so G HW Bush invaded and killed 150,000.
Then sonny boy invaded and killed ...no one knows how many, they don't keep score anymore or do body counts.
America has severe bad karma and it's only getting worse.

By: gdiafante on 9/13/12 at 7:15

Shut it, yogi. It doesn't matter what he does, you'd find fault with it, which makes your opinion irrelevant.

Darge, Japan is in worse economic shape than us...and I don't think they really have the military...

We're the world police because no one else ever steps up. Sad but true.

By: Ummm... on 9/13/12 at 7:16

When morons like the ones who made this "film" ridiculing Mohammad are allowed to distribute their hate speech wherever they please (with arabic sub-titles, no less), we shouldn't be surprised at the response- given that the Ayatollah in Iran advocated the death of Salman Rushdie over some passages in one of his novels in 1989. Muslims obviously don't view this kind of crap as the "exercise of free speech," and considering the consequences for our ambassador, maybe we shouldn't either.

By: Loner on 9/13/12 at 7:18

Good morning, Nashville.

We discussed this topic yesterday, today, we know more, but all the facts are not yet in.

UFD Question #1: What's your reaction to the violence in Benghazi, Libya, that left a U.S. ambassador dead along with members of his staff?

This was a preventable tragedy. Somebody dropped the ball.

The perpetrators were successful in degrading US public opinion concerning Libya and Libyans. Polls show that approval for the US Administration in Libya is the highest of any Arab or Muslim country. Approval for Obama's Administration is much higher in Libya than it is in Israel....Obama is pretty much despised in the Jewish state.

UFD Question #2: If it's true the violence leading to the deaths was prompted in part by an American-made video that criticized the Prophet Muhammad should those who promoted the video be held responsible or reprimanded in some way?

Some experts believe that the Benghazi attack was already planned and ready to go on 9-11....the riots over the US-made hate film may have been an unplanned distraction...the raiders took advantage of the chaos to carry out their well-planned attack, according to these "experts".

As for those who produce hate films designed to incite riots, I say treat them like we would treat any jerk who would yell, "FIRE" in a crowded theater. Free speech has its limits....this "film" went over the top, IMO.

The Egyptian Coptic cleric who promoted the film should be deported back to Egypt, IMO. If the producer really is an Israeli-American...and there is now doubt on that...then he should also be deported, IMO. As for Pastor Terry Jones, they should ship the Pastor to Gitmo, for interrogation; he is a domestic terrorist.....people have died because of his stunts.

The families of those slain in Libya should be able to sue the makers and promoters of this film for damages in a civil action....that's probably the best way to deal with those whose hate-filled "free speech" results in murderous mayhem.

Bishop Romney tried to make political hay out of these riots...he succeeded in getting his pant leg caught in the hay-bailer....today, he is in denial about all that....he insists that he's OK and that he did the right thing....no regrets, as the GOP's standard bearer is slowly, but surely dragged into the hay-bailer....this is not going to be pretty, folks.....RIP Romney & Ryan.

By: gdiafante on 9/13/12 at 7:20

That's my point too, ummm...what exactly did they think the Muslim reaction would be, given the history of those who parody/trash the religion? Hell, there were death threats to the creators of South Park when they had Muhammed on there...

By: gdiafante on 9/13/12 at 7:22

Obama's line about Romney shooting first and aiming later is spot on. No country can afford a knee-jerk idiot at the helm.

By: Loner on 9/13/12 at 7:29

Amen on your 7:22, Gd....Romney squeezed the trigger before withdrawing his pistol from its holder....now his designer cowboy boot is filling with blood, as he tries to walk without limping...I'm OK, he tells his fans...just a flesh wound....heh, heh...

By: Rasputin72 on 9/13/12 at 7:35

The U.S. Ambassador died in vain.

I would like to see Ummm,Slacker,Bfra,Dargent7,BlanketNazi and Captain Nemo sent to Libya to straighten this mess out.

If the Muslims think Chris Stevens and the Filmmaker were an affront to their meager existence they will be delirious with their relationships with these "people"

I think America would be very proud!~I know that I would be.

By: Loner on 9/13/12 at 7:37

Who is more panicky and trigger-happy: John McCain or Willard Romney? The former POW or the draft-dodger?

BTW, Sarah Palin came out in support of the film maker's "free speech" rights. OMG, McCain and Palin could have been elected....the whole Middle East would be in flames by now....and the Twin Towers attack would have been eclipsed by now....full blown Holy War would be well underway.

I'm glad that our POTUS thinks before opening his trap.....as we can clearly see, Romney is a hot-headed, vindictive theocrat....may cooler heads prevail..

By: Kosh III on 9/13/12 at 7:38

Romney's response (and ours) should have been that Obama is President, he's not; he supports the Commander-in-Chief and will let the President handle it.

But patriotic support for our elected leaders is old hat. I guess he will say or do anything, no matter how despicable if it helps get rid of the uppity colored boy in the White House.

By: Loner on 9/13/12 at 7:39

Rasp, you left the lone one out of your deportation list....an oversight?

By: parnell3rd on 9/13/12 at 7:41

gdia, hey, i've been saying for years. If the rest of the world does not like us, bring our troops home and stop the US taxpayes money going into those countries.
Besides, why don't you shut up. Yogi has the right to express his opinion just like others in here who always attack republican's.

By: dargent7 on 9/13/12 at 7:42

America stands for the 1st Amendment. Freedom of speech.
These animals are always on a hair-trigger reaction formation.
Mohammed was depicted in a cartoon 5 years ago, and they went nuts. A book 25 years ago....they went nuts. Now, a YouTube video, and they go nuts.
They're just plain nuts.
But, invite them into Murfeesboro with open arms, because they are a peaceful, loving poeople, with so much to offer America.
Like f****'in what?
Name ONE thing Muslims have to offer America.
Diversity? We've got that. Shar'ia Law, we don't want that. Suppression? We've gone over that.
Name one thing.

By: Loner on 9/13/12 at 7:43

I agree, Kosh...Romney should have kept his mouth shut....and he is doubling down now on his original remarks...no retreat...no clarification....no apologies....he's standing his ground...though he is standing on political quicksand....he refuses to recognize his predicament...he don't need no steenking life-line...he's fine.

The GOP should start their talent search for 2016....their boy is going down fast.

By: parnell3rd on 9/13/12 at 7:44

Yea, d7 said i say the same old thing, well today was the 10,464,999 he refered to bush's wars. So really, who is the broken record!

By: Ummm... on 9/13/12 at 7:45

Rasputin, the bigoted monk who believes in the sanctity of wealth and possessions, once again puts his abject moral bankruptcy on display. Loner, I guess you rank as people, and not "people."

By: parnell3rd on 9/13/12 at 7:46

Well if Romney should keep his mouth shut, then how about the rest of the USA? Should we keep our mouth's shut? Then why don't you all start practicing what you preach right now?
More coffee, then going to work to practice my constitutional rights!!!!!

By: Loner on 9/13/12 at 7:47

Dargent's anti-Muslim rant is reminiscent of Nazi propaganda concerning the value of Jews to society....Jews were portrayed as filthy parasites upon the body politik of Germany....D7 and millions of others believe that Muslims are filthy parasites upon the body politik of America.

Hitler had a plan for dealing with the "vermin"....what is your final solution, Dargent7?

By: gdiafante on 9/13/12 at 7:48

Besides, why don't you shut up.

Blow it out your ass, parnell. You're as dumb as yogi but at least you admit it. Both of you are better served in a remedial Kindergarten class than trying to post logical, coherent thoughts on this site.

By: Loner on 9/13/12 at 7:49

The rest of the USA is not a candidate for the Commander-In-Chief job, Parnell...can't you see how ridiculous your post is? Go to work and pay your taxes, like a man....cut the whiny sniping....thanks.

By: gdiafante on 9/13/12 at 7:50

Well if Romney should keep his mouth shut, then how about the rest of the USA?

You don't seem to be able to grasp the concept of being an average American citizen versus Presidential candidate.

By: Captain Nemo on 9/13/12 at 7:51

Good morning.

Ask01 has two well written post and bring to mine why is this taking place today and why is the U.S. playing the part that it knows what is best for the rest of the world and religious leader.

Religion is just another tool to use to control the masses and in this case in Libya it has two evil faces. First he video was produced by a man that first clamed to be Israeli, but now that seem to be false. The actors say that the finale cut was not what they acted and their words have been dubbed in places.

Second the attack in Lybia appears to be arranged by al-Qaeda.

By: yogiman on 9/13/12 at 7:53

56 days left. We'll soon know if we have our USA back or have moved the USA into communism with Barry.

By: Rasputin72 on 9/13/12 at 7:54

LONER.........Your high degree of intelligence excludes you from this group.

By: yogiman on 9/13/12 at 7:57

They're attacking Republican because they're dumbocraps, parnell3rd. They're biggest problem is they have no idea my political thoughts.

They're really exposing themselves on their stupidity. Or should I say ignorance?

By: Captain Nemo on 9/13/12 at 7:57

Steady gdia yogi only wants the attention and nothing else.

By: gdiafante on 9/13/12 at 7:58

And in 57 days I expect Yogi to move to Canada. Poor Canucks...

By: gdiafante on 9/13/12 at 8:00

Yogi's political thought: everyone that opposes him are Communists.

FYI: They tried that in the 50's, ultimately, it didn't work. Where's Murrow when you need him?

By: Captain Nemo on 9/13/12 at 8:01

Loner, our boy Rasputin left you out because you were not a part of the team the shown his to be a fraud.

By: Captain Nemo on 9/13/12 at 8:03

U.S. Envoy to Libya May Have Died in Assault by al-Qaeda

Sept. 13 (Bloomberg) -- The four-hour assault on the U.S. diplomatic mission in Benghazi may have been orchestrated by groups tied to al-Qaeda, lawmakers said as U.S. officials began to investigate the attack that killed Ambassador Chris Stevens.

http://www.sfgate.com/business/bloomberg/article/U-S-Envoy-to-Libya-May-Have-Died-in-Assault-by-3861651.php

By: yogiman on 9/13/12 at 8:05

Loner,

If your boy Barry is successful going against his "word" when he stated if he wasn't successful in putting the US "back on its feet" he would only serve one term. So..., is putting the USA so far deeper into debt his intended "success" theme? Or was he just making one more lie when he made that statement as a joke?