Up or Debate: Haslam's budget

Tuesday, January 29, 2013 at 12:19am

What's your reaction to Gov. Bill Haslam proposed next state budget, unveiled at Monday night's State of the State address? What do you think about the possible closing of the Cordell Hull Building

Filed under: City Voices
Tagged: Up for Debate

134 Comments on this post:

By: Loner on 1/29/13 at 9:34

By: BenDover on 1/29/13 at 9:19

That's the cover story, loner, and the Whitehouse appreciates your more than dogmatic attention to its spin.

Glad to see that you appreciated the spin, Ben...the dogmatic transmission....that's the vital part of the intellectual drive train....don't you agree?

By: BenDover on 1/29/13 at 9:38

gd, Obama jacked up spending 19% in his first year to deal with the 'crisis' and really hasn't looked back. We're running year over year deficits $1,000,000,000,000 over trend while we should be seeing the benefits of standing down in Iraq and Afghanistan. Government spending is now over 25% of GDP with only 15% covered by revenues and the other 10% in loans mostly from Ben Weimar Bernanke (whose stash from his '07 securities bail-out has got to be running low by now).

By: BenDover on 1/29/13 at 9:43

I've heard it put before if you don't believe in God you'll believe in anything, loner. I've seen dogmatic devotion to communism, statism, environmentalism, liberalism, nationalism and most recently Obamaism.

As Ferris Bueller put it:

Not that I condone fascism, or any -ism for that matter. -Ism's in my opinion are not good. A person should not believe in an -ism, he should believe in himself. I quote John Lennon, "I don't believe in Beatles, I just believe in me." Good point there. After all, he was the walrus. I could be the walrus. I'd still have to bum rides off people.

By: bfra on 1/29/13 at 9:50

Beb - You just suffer from BenDoverism! A cure could be paying more attention to facts instead of trumped up opinions.

By: yogiman on 1/29/13 at 9:53

Two youtubes I saw last night making some very interesting avid points. And they weren't against Gov. Haslam.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=58Bz)TbXPRY/ and www.youtube.com/watch?v=KaERR6SVao/

By: Captain Nemo on 1/29/13 at 9:54

Lets not forget to mention Bushism, Ben.

By: Loner on 1/29/13 at 10:01

Ben wrote, "We're running year over year deficits $1,000,000,000,000 over trend while we should be seeing the benefits of standing down in Iraq and Afghanistan."

Ben, here is a snippet from a Reuters article dated Dec. 19, 2011, which provides pertinent details on the 2012 US budget:

BASE BUDGET VERSUS WAR-RELATED FOREIGN AID

The legislation provides $42.1 billion in regular funding for the State Department and foreign aid in 2012, which is a cut of more than $6 billion from the 2011 level.

But when another $11.2 billion in war-related foreign aid for Afghanistan and Iraq is added in, such as money for counterterrorism and humanitarian assistance, the total for 2012 is $53.3 billion. That total is actually an increase of some $5 billion over the comparable amount for 2011.

House and Senate aides said the increase was partly fueled by more spending in Iraq, where U.S. troops are leaving and the State Department is taking over pay for some security forces and police training previously funded by the Pentagon.

Source:
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/12/19/us-usa-aid-idUSTRE7BI1KO20111219

So much for any "peace dividend" in Iraq and Afghanistan...the Bush-Cheney military adventurism there has resulted in huge apparently-eternal additional expenditures and massive deficits....all that and increased animosity towards the USA....these were/are totally counter-productive wars, based on "sexed up" intelligence and greed.

By: BenDover on 1/29/13 at 10:03

Oh, I have the facts brother.

That TARP loan where the repayments were supposed to go back against the deficit... Obama repent it completely and then on top of respending all of that; they increased new spending back up to the one time crisis level and kept it there for another 3 years and counting.

It's simple self delusion to consider Obama, President Thrifty, yet there you are.

All the utter bullsh!t about Guantanamo detention used to undermine President Bush... total crap. Gitmo is still open because it was the best way to handle these whackos who intend us another 9/11 every week should they get the opportunity... in fact they just shut down the office charged with the closing of the facility since there's no real value to Obama in maintaining the myth anymore.

And then the inauguration speech. No more pretense... no more lying to the voters... just unabashed social and economic liberalism on parade. Call it bait and switch... sometimes I wonder how politicians avoid charges of criminal fraud on the voters.

Oh well... confirmation biases... self delusion... perceptions trumping reality. These are the norm not the exception anymore.

By: Rasputin72 on 1/29/13 at 10:05

LONER..,.....,Your posts always relects two things. (1) Intelligence and (2) your bias.

Have you taken into consideration that one possibility for the narrow range of posters is the fact that your definition of a troll is anyone who does not view your bias as theirs.

You must remember that this is a red state and debating with you is one thing but having the Simple Six as your team mates is not a prescription for having dialog with an intelligent red state participant.

I am asked by those who know I enjoy frolicking with the vermin on this site why I lower myself to a level of dialog with a class of humanity that should be seen and not heard?

My response is , I deplore opinions by people who have no resume for success or for that matter any past success.

They deserve to have their noses rubbed in their own excrement.

By: Captain Nemo on 1/29/13 at 10:09

Not knowing that yogi was made up to be a pool table, Rasputin kissed the 8 and cue balls.

By: BenDover on 1/29/13 at 10:09

As has been noted on many occasions before we entered into Afghanistan and Iraq with large bipartisan consensus including the Democratic House and Senate leadership.

The cluster-f*ck arose when the Dems decided to Monday morning quarter-back their own decision and display internal American strife over the issues to our enemies as a political football. This emboldened the terrorists, caused great pause in the Iraq population that George H. Bush had abandoned to Saddam's torture and desolation in '91 and basically stretched the process out another 5 years beyond what was necessary.

By: pswindle on 1/29/13 at 10:10

Haslam's voucher program; I can't see this happening without lawsuit after lawsuit. First, there is a little thing called separation of state and church that plainly states in the Constitution, and if you think that parents are going to sit back and let some other child go to a private school and their child was not chosen, all hell will break out. If you think that struggling parents at private schools will allow students getting a free education and not paying as they are for their child. But MBA and Harpeth Hall has already said no way is your child coming to our school on vouchers. How much power will the Haslam Administratiion put on the other schools to accept the vouchers. MBA and Harpeth Hall may have to take one of their choice to say , "I have one." Maybe Rhee and Huffman's daughters can get a voucher for Harpeth Hall since they are already there. What did Rhee say, I am a public school Mom?

By: Captain Nemo on 1/29/13 at 10:12

I am proud to be a member of the simple 6 and not one of the two gene duh (yogi and Raspy)

By: Loner on 1/29/13 at 10:13

Thank you, Rasp for the double-edged compliment.

I won't attempt to define the word, "troll"...but I know one when I see one...and we have a couple of them on these Up For Debate boards...I won't name names....they know who they are....most of us recognize troll droppings when they appear here.

By: bfra on 1/29/13 at 10:16

Raspy = I am asked by those who know I enjoy frolicking with the vermin on this site why I lower myself to a level of dialog with a class of humanity that should be seen and not heard?

My response is , I deplore opinions by people who have no resume for success or for that matter any past success.

They deserve to have their noses rubbed in their own excrement.
===============================================================
So you put your own failures on the board, as fantasies, so they can be laughed at and your nose rubbed in your own stupidity.
.

By: Loner on 1/29/13 at 10:18

And now, a selected passage from the Book Of Poupon:

I am asked by those who know I enjoy frolicking with the vermin on this site why I lower myself to a level of dialog with a class of humanity that should be seen and not heard?

My response is , I deplore opinions by people who have no resume for success or for that matter any past success.

They deserve to have their noses rubbed in their own excrement.

Thus sayeth Rasputin, the Mad Monk....the peasants are revolting.

By: Loner on 1/29/13 at 10:20

Bfra and I are on the same page in the NCP hymnal this morning.

By: BenDover on 1/29/13 at 10:21

Vouchers have been very effective in places like DC, pswindle.

Government's afraid of losing it's vehicle for indoctrination though.

By: BenDover on 1/29/13 at 10:21

it's --shb--> its

By: Loner on 1/29/13 at 10:24

Someone must have rubbed Rasputin's nose in his own excrement...now, the whole world smells like feces...and he refers to us as, "vermin"....go wash your face, Rasp...then take a deep breath...life isn't so bad after all.

By: BenDover on 1/29/13 at 10:25

pertaining to government budgets...

"Weighing benefits against costs is the way most people make decisions — and the way most businesses make decisions, if they want to stay in business. Only in government is any benefit, however small, considered to be worth any cost, however large." -- Thomas Sowell

By: gdiafante on 1/29/13 at 10:35

Government's afraid of losing it's vehicle for indoctrination though.

That's right. learning is indoctrination. You're a dumbass conspiracy nut with one message Dems are the boogieman. ****ing crybaby...

And, FYI: Ferris was wrong. The walrus Paul.

By: gdiafante on 1/29/13 at 10:35

s/h/b the walrus was Paul.

By: Loner on 1/29/13 at 10:42

Homophone error caught by Ben Dover....nice catch, Ben.

Government losing its "vehicle for indoctrination"? You mean the government vehicle with the dogmatic transmission, Ben?

Ben would shift taxpayer resources, away from funding government vehicles for indoctrination, vehicles with dogmatic transmissions, towards funding faith-based vehicles for indoctrination, vehicles with problematic transmissions.

I prefer the secular government vehicle, Ben....the faith-based vehicle has been the source of human misery over the millennia..that's why the Founders junked the failed, poorly-designed vehicle and designed the secular replacement vehicle...it's working quite well, by comparison.

By: Loner on 1/29/13 at 10:45

Educate...Indoctrinate...Inculcate...Debilitate...it's all in one's frame of reference, isn't it?

By: slacker on 1/29/13 at 10:46

Good observation concerning Gitmo Ben.The Chicago political monolith played that issue like a violin. Now all is well, no torture only reasoning sessions.. with the nicer CIA cadre. If they had taken a vote, I'm guessing most P.O.W's would prefer a tropical climate over a north-east winter.

By: BenDover on 1/29/13 at 10:51

"Expecting government schools to educate their students as to the proper (limited) role of government is a SEVERE conflict of interest…to say the least."

... or to even mention limited government as a possible alternative, for that matter.

By: yogiman on 1/29/13 at 10:55

Loner,

How can you recognize troll droppings when you can't even recognize a usurper in office because you have no idea who in the hell he is or where he is from?

Do you just specialize in one element: Barry's my man?

By: Loner on 1/29/13 at 10:57

Gitmo is located on Cuban soil and the Cubans have never cashed a single rent check for the naval base located on that disputed tract of land....the UN could vote for the US to git from gitmo....that would be a great excuse to shut the place down...the whole thing, not just the Bush-Cheney EDICT (Extra-judicial Detention & Interrogation Center Tract).

By: BenDover on 1/29/13 at 10:59

gd... doesn't it offend your sensibilities to have to defend the left's view when, in truth, you're more of a moderate?

We're not debating absolutes but direction.

I'm not saying government should be banished; but instead, only that government has overstepped its role with respect to size, scope and expense.

How can you derive any enjoyment in the debate by defending that which is demonstrably out of hand?

By: gdiafante on 1/29/13 at 10:59

Are you referring to college, Ben? Because I'm pretty sure that K-12 doesn't really expound on political theory. Typical wingnut...

I'm getting sick of all this whining about what's being taught because it might contradict someone's personal beliefs. The irony is that Ben and other wingnuts would gladly use public schools for Conservative "indoctrination" if they could get away with it.

FYI to rational thinking people: schools are not indoctrination camps. If it were, and the message was Liberalism, we wouldn't be center-right country.

This country is going to shit because of people like Ben.

By: Loner on 1/29/13 at 10:59

Troll droppings at 10:55....recognized as such and avoided....the troll is back.

By: BenDover on 1/29/13 at 11:09

I'll say it's a shame that the top 10 list is no longer allowed in schools because if its association with our Judeo/Christian heritage that is now, thanks to the ACLU is heretic instead.

Maybe we could par it down to something we can all agree on rather than throwing it all out and sacrificing it on the altar of moral relativism, gd.

As far as K-12 they taught my kids the falsehood that Darwin being right proved religion was wrong. They taught my kids that if I (or other parents) smoked a cigar or cigarettes or drank beer I was an idiot and then carried on about children being out of control was the parent's fault.

They showed them stupid propaganda videos by Al Gore and used fear to advance the global warming industry far beyond any reasonable cost benefit while at the same time demonized the capital economy as greed and selfishness not understanding at all it is upon the capital economy that the luxuries of education, environmentalism and altruism rest.

Our public schools are far from innocent bystanders in the march toward leftist utopia and away from our founding principles that have made us the great nation we are.

By: Loner on 1/29/13 at 11:10

Ben, look at places on this planet where government has NOT overstepped its role with respect to size, scope and expense....places like Liberia...Somalia...Yemen....the list of failed states is a growing one.

I prefer a state with law and order, checks and balances, cooler heads prevailing...as opposed to lawless places, where rugged individualism is realized at gunpoint and warlords rule by way of horror....I'm sure that you do too.

Finding the balance point is the issue......in the real world, we need both the government guns & the government butter...human nature being what it is.

By: BenDover on 1/29/13 at 11:13

I was about to comment on how pleasant it was here today without yogi usurping the podium again. Now all my thoughtful commentary, whether you agree with it or not, gets to be shat upon and buried along with yogi's birther cat-turds in this otherwise acceptable sand-box.

By: Loner on 1/29/13 at 11:20

Ben says, "I'll say it's a shame that the top 10 list is no longer allowed in schools because if its association with our Judeo/Christian heritage that is now, thanks to the ACLU is heretic instead."

The "top 10 " list is the Ten Commandments, right?

If that is what you are calling the Decalogue, then I must insist that publicly and conspicuously displaying them in a public school is inappropriate and should be banned...same goes for the dozens of Jewish Mitzvats, which is the full list of Moses' (and other Jewish prophet's) commandments...same goes for commandments taken from the Koran, that is to say, Sharia Law....or any other commandments taken from any Holy Scripture.

That faith-based stuff could be discussed in a course entitled, "Comparative Theology"...but such courses are not usually included in the publicly funded K-12 syllabus....IMO, they ought to be.

By: yogiman on 1/29/13 at 11:24

A little history, gdiafante.

In my school years, on the first day of school every year we went to our 'home room' to learn what we were going to study that year. We then then to a privately owned bookstore and bought our books.

The government decided all children should study the same subjects and established the Department of Education.

History will show you the communist party's goal is to teach all children the same subjects, basically making them all think the same thing in being under government control throughout their lives.

We now have a known communist in our President's office and he is on his way to a full takeover. And the point that congress allowed it to happen should scare the hell out of you for your children's futures.

The points I made at 9:53 should tell you something. And if you like Fred Thompson's "way of saying it" go to www.fredthompsonsamerica.com and listen to what he said about Hillary Clinton's roll in the Ambassador's death.

And frankly, gdiafante, I don't care whether any of you guys "listen" to me or not. I simply post what I've learned. I know I don't have your computer knowledge to explain "where it came from" so you can take it or leave it. Time will tell and it's getting shorter on Barry's takeover.

And by the way, I see where Lamar Alexander has sided with Obama over 60% of the issues. Corker isn't much better.

By: Loner on 1/29/13 at 11:33

Ben...Yogiman and you share the same distrust of central government....especially in the realm of "education"....you share the same passion for the 2nd amendment....both are God-fearing believers in the Ten Commandments and you both support financing the Jewish State with US taxpayer funds....you both hate labor unions and you both blame Barack Hussein Obama for our current national woes.

Yogi & Ben....Republican soul-mates, bridging the generational gap.

It's almost heart-warming.

By: BenDover on 1/29/13 at 11:38

But loner... certainly the time tested advice of thou shalt not steal, murder, bear false witness, commit adultery, covet; and the behest to honor our elders... certainly these are applicable to modern life and should not be damned to the ash-heap by their association with our other religious traditions.

These are integral to civilized society, wouldn't you agree.

By: Captain Nemo on 1/29/13 at 11:40

Rasputin the leader of the 2 gene duds, thinks that he and yogi are supreme. Which they are of the misfits.

By: Loner on 1/29/13 at 11:45

Taking off on Ben's cat-related analogy.....Ben, Bud, Govskeptic & Yogi all share the same cat food...but, we all share the same litter box....thank the Lords of Felinia that the NCP changes the litter on a near-daily basis...the box starts to stink by Monday morning, however....same litter box all weekend long....so they usually put out two boxes on Fridays....one is for the UFD topic, the other for Burch.

I use the equivalent of a cat litter rake, to remove the troll droppings....trouble is, where do you fling that stuff, once you've raked it out? I've been flinging some of it at my old friend, Ben Dover....just for shitz & giggles.

By: Loner on 1/29/13 at 12:02

Ben pontificates: But loner... certainly the time tested advice of thou shalt not steal, murder, bear false witness, commit adultery, covet; and the behest to honor our elders... certainly these are applicable to modern life and should not be damned to the ash-heap by their association with our other religious traditions.

Ben, nearly every organized religion has a line about treating our fellow human beings as we ourselves would like to be treated. The generalized condemnation of stealing, murder and bearing false witness can be traced to such language...same goes for respect for our elders, after all, if we are lucky, we will all be elderly someday....the Bible-based Decalogue is not unique in this respect.

The parts about coveting persons, places and things is simply good advice, to ignore it is not sinful, just stupid.....possibly illegal, but who is to say what is, "sinful" or not? That's not a call for humans to make.

In my UU church's meeting hall, we proudly display a poster that adds legitimacy to my claim, that all the major religions share this, "do unto others, as you would have them do unto you." idea....let's not put the King James version of things on public display in public buildings...thanks.

By: yogiman on 1/29/13 at 12:07

You know, Loner, it's comical. You so readily condemn me for seeing Israel as a friendly nation but you so readily condemn me for resenting usurper Barry Soetoro ala Barack Obama in our Oval Office.

And you, as others, have made several remarks posting you would like to see me leave the 'pot' filled with your beans (BS) only. Ha! I just took a test to see how old I'm going to get and it looks like you're going to have to put up with me for another 15 years.

Wanna take the test? It's an insurance test: //media.nmfn.com/tnetwork/lifespan/

Don't lie on the questions now.

By: yogiman on 1/29/13 at 12:11

Another point we're facing now; Barry is making an effort to give citizenship to over 11 million illegal aliens; for their vote, of course.

Read the issues on www.usillegalaliens.com/impact_of_illegal_immigration_crime_summary.html

By: Loner on 1/29/13 at 12:17

Ben, let's clarify things...here is the notorious passage:

Exodus 20

New International Version (NIV)
The Ten Commandments

20 And God spoke all these words:

2 “I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery.

3 “You shall have no other gods before[a] me.

4 “You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. 5 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, 6 but showing love to a thousand generations of those who love me and keep my commandments.

7 “You shall not misuse the name of the Lord your God, for the Lord will not hold anyone guiltless who misuses his name.

8 “Remember the Sabbath day by keeping it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is a sabbath to the Lord your God. On it you shall not do any work, neither you, nor your son or daughter, nor your male or female servant, nor your animals, nor any foreigner residing in your towns. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.

12 “Honor your father and your mother, so that you may live long in the land the Lord your God is giving you.

13 “You shall not murder.

14 “You shall not commit adultery.

15 “You shall not steal.

16 “You shall not give false testimony against your neighbor.

17 “You shall not covet your neighbor’s house. You shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, or his male or female servant, his ox or donkey, or anything that belongs to your neighbor.”

The Creationism concept, item 11, does not belong in any public school curriculum, posing as a reasonable alternative view of how life on earth began.

I do not think that putting your neighbor's wife in the same category as "his male or female servant, his ox or donkey", item 17, is quite in-step with today's values, Ben.

The parts about God giving the Promised Land to the Jews, item 12, is also a bit problematic for some Americans....Holy Wars Suck....like a black hole of hate.

And should we shut down all business and commerce on the Sabbath? Would you prefer Saturday or Sunday, Ben? That should help grow the economy, right?

I could go on...I hope that I made my point.

By: Loner on 1/29/13 at 12:22

NCP Public Service Announcement: Troll droppings @ 12:07 and @ 12:11...the contractions are increasing with frequency...avoid the troll droppings.

By: Captain Nemo on 1/29/13 at 12:23

Does the 3rd commandment mean there is more than 1God?

By: Captain Nemo on 1/29/13 at 12:28

What about yogi commandment; Let no facts stand in your way of knowledge.

By: Loner on 1/29/13 at 12:30

Item 5, In the Exodus 20 passage is quite troubling...God will punish the descendants of the sinners for 3 or 4 generations; but be merciful to the believer's descendants, for a thousand generations?

As a UU-member, that flies in the face of my beliefs...but I am not demanding that my beliefs be posted in the public schools etc this is where Ben and I disagree....but, I still love the old rattlesnake.

By: Captain Nemo on 1/29/13 at 12:32

Commandment 15; You shall not steal, but it is OK to cheat on your taxes.